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Are you a 'good' putter?
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Lary1
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
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Friday May 29, 2020 5:56 PM
I found this on the PGA site. Anywhere between 31-35 putts per round is acceptable good putting for the average golfer. 26-30 putts per round and you have now crossed over into the realm of great putting. ...
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 Message #95160 - This was a reply to message #95149
FirstFlightFX-101
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
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Friday May 29, 2020 6:07 PM
If I ever meet a player that racks up the majority of his/her rounds per year at Yucaipa GC; and, consistently putts 34-36 per round...then I will ask for their autograph and buy him a cold one because he is a putting pro! ;-)
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 Message #95161 - This was a reply to message #95149
michaelko
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
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Friday May 29, 2020 8:39 PM
QUOTED  I have a question (and I'm not just asking this to be a jerk). When you putt from the fringe, does it count as a green in regulation?

fair... for my personal stats, yeah.

to be further clear, if your typical fringe is a yard... i'll never putt more than a yard on fringe grass. i'm not a texas wedge kind of guy.

also, if i'm just off the fairway, but it's still playable as a normal shot, and the rough is not penal, I count it as a fairway hit.

common sense stuff... but i get it's not the right way. but hey, these stats mean nothing other than my personal edification
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 Message #95163 - This was a reply to message #95159
Nickesquire
RE: Are you a "good" putter?
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Friday May 29, 2020 11:38 PM
Average Putts:
- per Hole: 1.78
- per GIR: 2.05
- per 18: 32.03

The above is for over 1,350 rounds in the GK Scoretracker. My putting stats have improved over the years.

QUOTED  I have a question (and I'm not just asking this to be a jerk). When you putt from the fringe, does it count as a green in regulation?


I try to be consistent with the way my research indicates that the PGA Tour tracks official golf stats.

Fringe = no GIR. Any shot from the fringe regardless of the club utilized is NOT a putt.

First cut of the rough = no fairway. May have been in the fairway the entire ball fight and until the last 2" of roll. But if it is not still on the fairway after the shot ends, it is not a fairway hit.

If any part of my ball is touching the green or the fairway, I count it as a GIR or fairway hit.

I also track "Sand Saves" for all sand shots within 50 yards of the green for that reason.

[[Edited by Nickesquire on Thursday November 11, 2021 12:43 PM]]
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The goal has always been long and straight! But since I can no longer hit them long, hopefully straighter could be achieved more than occasionally?
 Message #95164 - This was a reply to message #95163
Deepsea14
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
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Saturday May 30, 2020 6:29 AM
There's putters and there is putting. Many variations of style and techniques as well as wrench (club) designs to get the ball in the hole.

The numbers don't lie, but don't tell the whole story either.

GIMMES ?? !!! they're fine and have their place in our game. If it's for bogey or better please don't beg me for one. Many times I say "it's good' but if you had to make it could you?" Gets the mind prepped for those stroke play rounds play 'em down count them all.

Bottom line for me is; Can you make a knee knocker(2-4 footer (high %) when there is something on the line from any angle and break.

Yes = your a good roller of the rock.

It's just FUN!
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 Message #95166 - This was a reply to message #95164
FirstFlightFX-101
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
GKGC Par: GKGC Par Supporter GK Event: Played in a GK Event SCGA GK Golf Club: Member Birdie Chain: Stake Holder BCB Birdie Chain GK Cup Player: If you played in a GK Cup win or lose - you are acknowledged and appreciated! GK Guru: GK Gurus Review Writers

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Saturday May 30, 2020 10:11 AM
My best and worst averages, and where:
1.81 / 0 / 32.67 Arrowhead CC
2.22 / 0 / 40.00 Yucaipa GC

These are clues to why I will praise ACC over YGC. YGC has my #. Over time, I will improve my averages at YGC, so that I stop ending up with a "putting fat-lip"!
Cheers,
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 Message #95168 - This was a reply to message #95166
1PLUS1
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?

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Saturday May 30, 2020 11:45 AM
To answer your question Rob, I would say 'YES'. Not only do I 'feel' that I am but the stats would tend to back me up.

Since the Total-Putts-Per-Round stat can be skewed by the number of greens hit or missed, I look at the Average Number of-Putts Per-GIR stat as the best indicator when it comes to evaluating overall putting efficiency. As has already been mentioned, a strong short game can keep the Total-Putts-Per-GRound/Green averages low, thus providing someone a false sense of security, which is why the Putts-Per-GIR data is more relevant to me.

Another factor to consider when analyzing the data is the length of that first putt you're faced with once you get on the green. Consistently find yourself in the 25'-30' range to start with, your numbers will be high; conversely, cut that range in half, you should see better results. So while the stats may be helpful on their own, other factors also need to be taken into consideration in order to obtain an acccurate and representative assessment.

Now, if you're someone like Nickesquire, who not only records every single shot he hits during a round, but also every step and breath he takes, then you'd have a plethora of data from which to comprise a detailed spreadsheet...if that sort of stuff turns you on...thus making it possible identify the specific distances at which you excel and/or struggle on the greens.

Me, I like to keep it simple. I do not want to get buried under an avalanche of bloated statistical data; I find that stuff to be tedious and boring as hell. And that applies to all sports, not just golf, but that's another subject for another day.

I'm only interested in the basics and the Scoretracker data is sufficient in that regard. While I'm fully aware of the state of my putting game at all times, the stats serve as confirmation and perhaps a subtle reminder that some work may be in order...and not necessarily on the putting green.

For what it's worth...

---Putts Per Hole: 1.63

---Putts Per GIR: 1.78

---Putts Per Round: 29.28

*And using a putter to strike the ball from the fringe DOES NOT qualify the stroke as a 'putt'.

[

[[Edited by 1PLUS1 on Saturday May 30, 2020 5:06 PM]]
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 Message #95169 - This was a reply to message #95149
michaelko
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
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Monday June 1, 2020 8:31 AM
Let me argue this little point:

putting from the fringe.

I say, it's a putt. You are putting. It's a putting skill. If the goal is to see how well you putt, then that stroke should be in the putting equation.

Now, I understand the rules. And the reason for those rules is so that they can standardize the stats across thousands of players. If I'm using those stats for only myself, and no one is going to use them for any analysis, then who cares?

As far as I'm concerned, if I miss the green by a foot, and I'm still putting, it's the EXACT same result if I was one foot to the left. I'm putting for birdie.


In fact, I would argue, NOT counting that stroke as a putt will give you a false sense of improvement. Because your chances of making the second putt for a "1putt" is a lot higher. The fact remains, you putted to get to that spot.

So, to summarize:
if we are tracking the skill of putting, and putting off the fringe is fundamentally the same skill as putting on the green, it would make sense for you to consider that a putt. It would give the best picture of your putting skill.

But at the end of the day, why care about what I do? I don't care what you do... but if we were going to compare statistics, and let's say it's for a competition, we just have to have the same rules. Then it's all good.
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 Message #95191 - This was a reply to message #95169
1PLUS1
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?

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Monday June 1, 2020 9:08 AM
You're more than welcome to adhere to your own set of criteria but, taking it at face value, tould putting from the fringe with a hybrid count towards your total number of putts? What if you employ the 'Texas Wedge', where you strike the ball at its' equator with the club's leading edge due to a compromised lie...does that constitute a 'putting stat'? And at what distance away from the actual putting surface do your tenets apply? Would using a putter from 25 yards short of the 18th green at St. Andrews to I've been playing. navigate The Valley of Sin count as a putt in your book?

And just as you contend that not counting putts from the fringe as such will lead to a "false sense of improvement", the doing the opposite will yield results that skew towards the other end of the scale. And not all fringes are created equal either. Some areas may be well-maintained and tightly mown, providing a green-like scenario while others could be be clumpy and uneven in texture; hardly an equal playing field.

As it is, I rarely use my putter drom the fringe; going from one surface to the other presents a bg varable, enough so that I cannot subscribe to the idea that a putt from the fringe is the same as one on the green itself. It's like comparing shots from the rough to those from the fairway. Apples and oranges.

And as I understand it, the professional tours do not include putts from the fringe when compiling their statistical data. Makes sense to me and I've followed that guideline for the 50+ years I've been playing. What's next, shots that miss the green by a foot get lumped in with the GIR numbers?

[[Edited by 1PLUS1 on Monday June 1, 2020 9:16 AM]]
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 Message #95194 - This was a reply to message #95191
michaelko
RE: Are you a 'good' putter?
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Monday June 1, 2020 9:43 AM
QUOTED  would putting from the fringe with a hybrid count towards your total number of putts? What if you employ the 'Texas Wedge', where you strike the ball at its' equator with the club's leading edge due to a compromised lie...does that constitute a 'putting stat'?

if you are using a hybrid,you are not putting from the fringe, you are chipping. If you are using a wedge, you are chipping. You can only putt with a putter.
And I thought the 'Texas Wedge' was a putter from forever away.
QUOTED  And at what distance away from the actual putting surface do your tenets apply? Would using a putter from 25 yards short of the 18th green at St. Andrews to I've been playing. navigate The Valley of Sin count as a putt in your book?

As i've already stated, the fringe is usually about a yard... so most putts from the fringe are less than a yard over the fringe.

I don't like to putt over more than that.

If you are putting from 25 yds away, i would not count that as a putt, because that is not the same putting skill as on the green.


QUOTED  the doing the opposite will yield results that skew towards the other end of the scale

As i've already stated, this will make your putts per round skewed higher, but I feel it's a more accurate reflection of your putting skill. If you putt from the fringe 3 times in a round.. heck that's 3 less putts you counted... the difference btwn 32 and 35... which sounds a lot different. 32: you are pretty good; 35: very average. Changes the narrative quite a bit.



QUOTED  And not all fringes are created equal either. Some areas may be well-maintained and tightly mown, providing a green-like scenario while others could be be clumpy and uneven in texture; hardly an equal playing field.

I'd highly disagree here. Most fringes (1 yd collar around the green) at many courses are similar. If you are playing a course where the fringes are not puttable, then I feel bad for your options of golf courses.

I would consider putting off the fringe no different than accounting for a putt that is uphill or downhill. Just have to adjust your speed.


QUOTED  And as I understand it, the professional tours do not include putts from the fringe when compiling their statistical data.

As i've already stated, this is how they do it. But that's so they can standardize the stats to compare across golfers.

QUOTED  What's next, shots that miss the green by a foot get lumped in with the GIR numbers?


As I've already stated, yes. If I'm putting off the fringe, I consider that a green hit. The ensuing result is exactly the same; PUTTING for birdie.
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